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Canada’s Capital Challenge: Regulation, Energy, and the Next Wave of Growth | The Global Impact Podcast Episode 2

July 20, 2026

A discussion on capital, regulation, energy and future growth sectors in Canada, with a focus on long-term risks and opportunity.

 

[Energetic music] 

[Episode 2 of The Global Impact Podcast with Mitch Halickman, Stephanie Morais and Dominique Barker, titled " Canada's Capital Challenge: Regulation, Energy, and the Next Wave of Growth." It features the CIBC logo and the text "CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy" in the bottom left. Mitchell Halickman, Stephanie Morais, and Dominique Barker’s headshots are featured to the left.] 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (00:01) 

Welcome back everybody. Last episode, we talked about impact-adjusted ROE and how to put a number on the value that traditional financial statements miss. Today, we're doing something a little bit different. We're going to talk about where Canada itself might be mispricing risk and opportunity, and we cannot think of a better person to do that than someone who has actually sat on every side of the table. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (00:24) 

Dominique Barker is one of those rare people who's lived this from every angle. An engineer by training, a CFA and a CPA by designation, 10 years as portfolio manager at CIBC Asset Management, where she built out our integration across the entire sustainable platform, moving on to head of sustainability in our capital markets group globally. And after that, she decided to go join Lithium Royalty Corp. as CFO and Chief Sustainability Officer until its recent acquisition. I've known Dominique for many, many years and I'm really excited to have her on the podcast. Stephanie and I are really looking forward to our conversation. Thanks Dominique. Welcome to our podcast. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (01:08) 

Mitch and Stephanie, thank you so much for having me. That was quite the intro. Thank you. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (01:12) 

I think the best way to set up the tone for the conversation is to tell you about a story that I learned many years ago. Dominique knows the story too well, as does Steph, from Amory Lovins of the Rocky Mountain Institute. He speaks about how we tend to find solutions that are too narrow in nature when dealing with complex adaptive systems. And the way he phrases it is like this, you know, in Borneo in nineteen fifty five there was a problem. And mosquitoes were out of control, creating malaria. They didn't know what to do. The World Health Organization actually came in and decided to spray DDT over the entire area would have been super effective. They did. It was. They died. But so did wasps and so did cats eating caterpillars that decided to make the roofs fall on the people's heads. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (01:52) 

Ha ha. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (02:00) 

So it wasn't such a great outcome, and if the story ended there, great, but it didn't. The geckos then ate these insects that in turn were eaten by cats up until the cats started dying, and now Borneo had a huge infestation of rats creating typhus, which was way worse than the original malaria problem, quite literally. I swear to you, the WHO had to create a program called Operation Cat Drop and drop 14,000 cats into Porneo to repopulate and find balance. Now, what could any of that have to do with markets? I think the thing is often the solution to our problem is the problem when not looked at through a wide enough lens. That's some of the stuff I want to try to discuss here today. 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (02:48) 

Exactly. So as Mitch is saying, everything is really interconnected. You can't solve a really complex problem with a very narrow lens. So that said, Dominique, you have a strong view that Canada is making capital formation harder than it needs to be. You've been the institution allocating capital, the bank advising on it, and more recently the company trying to attract it. Can you talk to us a little bit more about that? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (03:14) 

Sure. Thanks, Stephanie. I'm starting to see how this is all connected, Mitch. So I was most recently CFO of a company called Lithium Royalty Corp. That's a company that, in my mind, has low risk and has a really low-cost business model. And for anyone who doesn't know what a royalty company is, it's when you take a percent of revenue. So we were taking a percent of revenue or a royalty across a number of lithium mines across the world. 

So the company IPO'd in 2023 with $1 billion Canadian valuation, but our float, so that's the amount that it's actually trading on the stock market, was only $150 million. That's because there was some private equity behind it. And what I've learned from that experience is that liquidity matters. 

You can have the best management team, the best assets, the greatest story ever. But in today's market, and we'll get into it a little bit, you need to be a certain size and a certain amount of float on the stock market to get attention. Personally, I think the markets have really evolved, especially in Canada over the last 20 to 30 years. Actually, I use the word evolved, but it's actually in a negative way. So I would say that they've changed in a negative way. 

And it's really limiting the ability for investors to help small companies grow. I don't know how we can fix this problem. I've got some different ideas, but I think it is a problem I see emerging getting worse year after year, particularly in Canada. Also, I think, and you know, when you talk about your cat story and like just the wider lens, the other issue to think about that's a detriment to capital formation in Canada has been the overburden of regulation. There are auditors involved and consultants and different all the stuff that needs to happen. We had a low-cost business model at Lithium Royalty Corp., but I was astounded at the amount of, in my opinion, non-productive work. Like it's not, it's just something that needed to get done, needed to happen as CFO of a Canadian small cap company. 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (05:35) 

Okay, great. A lot of things to talk about here. If regulation is pushing companies away from public markets, where does that leave investors? Because part of what we do is try to find value before the broader market catches on. 

So if the next generation of great companies stays private longer, that changes where the opportunity actually sits. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (05:55) 

Dominique, before you even answer that, it almost feels like what we're referring to is like a democratization of capital. Almost like the other direction. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (05:57) 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Okay, so we have to really be thinking about that retail investor and what their expectations are when they put money with you and Stephanie, for example. They're expecting a certain amount of liquidity. And so that I think is an emerging issue. While private equity solves a lot of problems because you don't have all of the reporting, the public reporting, there is reporting that goes to the private equity owner. But the burden of all of the regulation and disclosure that needs to happen really is much less for a private company. But that's where you come in, Mitch and Steph. You need to be able to explain to customers if they are going into a private equity product, and I'm happy I'm invested with you for the Alpine product, which is the Brookfield and Generation Investment Management. That's private. And I know that my money is in there for a very long time. It should be seven years plus. I'm thinking it's ten years plus, and that's my assumption and I know that. But that's retail investors need to understand then when they're putting money into either private credit products or private equity products, that they may be limited in liquidity. And as I discussed earlier, liquidity really does matter and matters as a public company investor, but also on the investment side. If you want to get your money out or you may and invest it in some a better opportunity or pay off debts or whatever, those customers really need to understand it. I guess for me the bottom line, if I was a genie and could be put back in a bottle, I wish we had not put in so many regulations. And I think that's Part of what we're seeing in Canada and in the US right now, they’re really starting to pull back on some of their regulation and disclosure. And even with the US going so far as to moving to disclosure to instead of quarterly reporting, but only twice per year. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (08:23) 

You know, listening to this, it's really a tale of two countries in a totally different direction. And if I've learned anything, maybe. One thing's for sure is money goes to where it's treated best. That's it. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (08:32) 

Yeah. You know, you hear that the Minister of Finance and Minister of Natural Resources in Canada describes money flows as water. Like it's gravity. It will just go to where it's easiest to go to. So absolutely you're onto something. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]  (08:58) 

Yeah. Yeah, and we don't necessarily always make it easy. But let's move on. Let's talk energy. so I think our listeners might have a bit of a strong reaction to this. So we find that we're now exporting natural gas to Germany as a country, and on the surface it sounds great, but Dom, you have a bit of a different take. what's up with that? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (09:05) 

Okay. Mitch, you and I have been looking at this for years and we've been watching sustainability and the energy transition and it is happening in other parts of the world. It's happening less so in Canada and even less so in the US. But if you go to China you talk to anyone who's been to China recently they will have come back being astounded at how many EVs are on the road there. 

And if you look at a barrel of oil, and if you Google it, you will see that about half goes towards gasoline. The rest goes to NAFTA or plastics or like jet fuel, for example. but most of it goes to gasoline. So as we have demand coming down, and the Financial Times is has been calling China will peak this year or next year at the latest, demand will peak and then start to go down. 

That's not a great thing for an energy exporter like Canada. And so I do worry about I mean we're so insular and we think that the rest of the world needs our energy. but I'm just I'm concerned that we might have the thesis wrong.  

So, you know, in the news recently we talked about contracting with German companies to buy some of our natural gas. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (10:58) 

Industrial base, right. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (11:02) 

I will say natural gas is different. Like I think natural gas, there's a heating value to it, there's an electricity part to it. 

That demand I think is going to grow over time. But what I would say a lot of the gas that will be sold to Germany will be going towards the industrial base. So companies the and again, I just use Chat GPT to say which companies are most energy intensive in in Germany. And it came out with BASF, which is a chemical company, Thyssenkrupp, I think it's a steel company, Covestro, Wacker, Lind, all of these companies have like they're going to use our natural gas and make better products out of it. Like why don't instead of us selling our natural gas, why don't we go to those companies and ask them to come to Canada and set up shop here and use our natural gas here, which would be a lot more efficient energy wise, but also would create a lot of jobs, would create a whole industrial base in Canada. So that's the sort of thinking that I'm lining up on. 

And that's where I get a little distressed about us continually exporting like you know just being a commodity exporter. It's not super value adding. and I'm just not sure how much it's going to impact it. We could take a different view and it could impact our economy much more positively if we had a wider lens, like you talked about in your opening statements with your cat story. 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]  (12:38) 

That's exactly the type of risk that doesn't show up cleanly on a discounted cash flow model. You're taking multi-decade bet on the world wanting energy dependence at the exact moment every major economy is trying to engineer its way out of dependence. This is really the essence of everything we talk about on this podcast. The risks that do not show up in a quarterly earnings call are often the ones that matter most over a 10 or 20 year holding period. So Dominique, as we close, we want to end on something forward-looking, positive, and promising. So we thought about it and came up with one final question for you. Mitch? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (13:15) 

Okay, go for it. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (13:16) 

I'm never good at one question, so it's one question, part A, part B.  

First, Steph, you couldn’t have said it better than myself. The essence of everything we're trying to explore lies in the last fifteen minutes of what we just discussed. So it's really, really great. There's so much to unpack here over time. But I always thought it's kind of important to be excited about tomorrow, even if I have no clue why. Sometimes. So as a parent you know, what does our generation have to do to get that bright light in our kids' eyes and have them be excited about what tomorrow brings for them here in Canada? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (13:56) 

Yeah, we're not making it very easy for them. I do have two kids. They're 19 and 20. And like most nineteen and twenty year olds, they do not listen to their mother. So I'll send them this podcast and maybe they'll listen to me through this medium. but you know, when I talk to them about when I think about the future and I talk to kids in university about the future and their job prospects or what they want to do. In fact, I just came from a lunch where I was talking to a mom giving similar advice. It's really about going to growth industries. Like what are the industries that are growing today or that have the highest potential to grow in the future? So for me in Canada, it feels like electricity, it feels like batteries and chemistry, AI or artificial intelligence, things like nuclear energy. Those are all I think promising areas to go to go into. But what I would also say, because I think there's a lot of pressure on kids to go to university. And I don't think university is the be all and end all. And I think trades or college are just as important as university and arguably more important.  

I don't know if you've heard this term wrench turner, like the wrench turner jobs. Those are going to take on greater importance in the future. and I recently met a couple, they're like 20 years old. They decided to forego university and went straight into a trade program for specialty in welding, and they're currently working on the small modular reactors. The first ones in the G7, they're being built in Canada. I don't know how many people are aware of this, but those will be the first small modular reactors or SMRs in the G’s in the world. There's a rumor that maybe China has one, but nobody's seen it. so this is kind of area that I think I would be thinking about going into. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (16:10) 

Amazing, you know, and those SMRs refer to those are not white elephants. I'm wondering whoever came up with that term. Do you have any idea? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (16:21) 

No, I know we had talked about the term white elephants and I guess in the context of pipelines because I don't know if they’re building another pipeline, I just don't want it to be a white elephant. Did you look it up? 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (16:39) 

Of course. But I much preferred to be more familiar with the song White Rabbit from Jefferson Airplane. I love that song. Anyway, all that to be said, listen, Dom, I knew this was going to be a fantastic conversation. I guess I can't be too surprised. You know, as Stephanie and I walk on our own sustainability road, we've learned so much every time we've spoken. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (16:46) 

of course. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (17:07) 

And you know, it's really been valuable. I really, really want to thank you for that. Thank you for sharing some of your beliefs with our clients, colleagues and friends on today's podcast. A million thanks. Steph, you want to close this up? 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (17:22) 

Yes, of course. Dominique, this has been great. Thank you to you and to everybody listening. If today's conversation gave you a new way to think about risk in your own portfolio, that is exactly what we're trying to do here. Lastly, and most importantly, thank you for your confidence and your trust. We recognize the importance of our role and are committed to helping navigate the path towards your goals in the years ahead. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]  (17:46) 

Dom, you have the last word. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (17:48) 

Well, I'll just say there's no one more passionate about sustainability than you. And I hope you're still working on I know Mitch has been working on trying to get the banks to come up with some sort of green mortgage and has had lots of great ideas. And so I keep working on it. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (17:53) 

Ha ha ha. 

We're not done with that one, Dom. It doesn't matter where you sit, what you're doing, where you land, to be continued. Steph knows all too much about it. I'm sometimes forbidden to discuss it. Thanks, guys. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (18:07) 

I'm sure you're not. 

 

​[Energetic outro music] 

[CIBC logo] 

[The CIBC logo and “CIBC Private Wealth” are trademarks of CIBC, used under license. “Wood Gundy” is a registered trademark of CIBC World Markets Inc.] 

[CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy logo] 

[Contact information Mitchell Halickman and Stephanie Morais] 

[CIBC Private Wealth consists of services provided by CIBC and certain of its subsidiaries, including CIBC Wood Gundy, a division of CIBC World Markets Inc. 

This information, including any opinion, is based on various sources believed to be reliable, but its accuracy cannot be guaranteed and is subject to change. 

Mitch Halickman is an Investment Advisor with CIBC Wood Gundy in Montreal. The views of Mitch Halickman do not necessarily reflect those of CIBC World Markets Inc. 

Stephanie Morais is an Associate Investment Advisor working with Mitch Halickman, Investment Advisor. 

If you are currently a CIBC Wood Gundy client, please contact your Investment Advisor.] 

[Energetic music] 

[Episode 2 of The Global Impact Podcast with Mitch Halickman, Stephanie Morais and Dominique Barker, titled " Canada's Capital Challenge: Regulation, Energy, and the Next Wave of Growth." It features the CIBC logo and the text "CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy" in the bottom left. Mitchell Halickman, Stephanie Morais, and Dominique Barker’s headshots are featured to the left.] 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (00:01) 

Welcome back everybody. Last episode, we talked about impact-adjusted ROE and how to put a number on the value that traditional financial statements miss. Today, we're doing something a little bit different. We're going to talk about where Canada itself might be mispricing risk and opportunity, and we cannot think of a better person to do that than someone who has actually sat on every side of the table. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (00:24) 

Dominique Barker is one of those rare people who's lived this from every angle. An engineer by training, a CFA and a CPA by designation, 10 years as portfolio manager at CIBC Asset Management, where she built out our integration across the entire sustainable platform, moving on to head of sustainability in our capital markets group globally. And after that, she decided to go join Lithium Royalty Corp. as CFO and Chief Sustainability Officer until its recent acquisition. I've known Dominique for many, many years and I'm really excited to have her on the podcast. Stephanie and I are really looking forward to our conversation. Thanks Dominique. Welcome to our podcast. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (01:08) 

Mitch and Stephanie, thank you so much for having me. That was quite the intro. Thank you. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (01:12) 

I think the best way to set up the tone for the conversation is to tell you about a story that I learned many years ago. Dominique knows the story too well, as does Steph, from Amory Lovins of the Rocky Mountain Institute. He speaks about how we tend to find solutions that are too narrow in nature when dealing with complex adaptive systems. And the way he phrases it is like this, you know, in Borneo in nineteen fifty five there was a problem. And mosquitoes were out of control, creating malaria. They didn't know what to do. The World Health Organization actually came in and decided to spray DDT over the entire area would have been super effective. They did. It was. They died. But so did wasps and so did cats eating caterpillars that decided to make the roofs fall on the people's heads. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (01:52) 

Ha ha. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (02:00) 

So it wasn't such a great outcome, and if the story ended there, great, but it didn't. The geckos then ate these insects that in turn were eaten by cats up until the cats started dying, and now Borneo had a huge infestation of rats creating typhus, which was way worse than the original malaria problem, quite literally. I swear to you, the WHO had to create a program called Operation Cat Drop and drop 14,000 cats into Porneo to repopulate and find balance. Now, what could any of that have to do with markets? I think the thing is often the solution to our problem is the problem when not looked at through a wide enough lens. That's some of the stuff I want to try to discuss here today. 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (02:48) 

Exactly. So as Mitch is saying, everything is really interconnected. You can't solve a really complex problem with a very narrow lens. So that said, Dominique, you have a strong view that Canada is making capital formation harder than it needs to be. You've been the institution allocating capital, the bank advising on it, and more recently the company trying to attract it. Can you talk to us a little bit more about that? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (03:14) 

Sure. Thanks, Stephanie. I'm starting to see how this is all connected, Mitch. So I was most recently CFO of a company called Lithium Royalty Corp. That's a company that, in my mind, has low risk and has a really low-cost business model. And for anyone who doesn't know what a royalty company is, it's when you take a percent of revenue. So we were taking a percent of revenue or a royalty across a number of lithium mines across the world. 

So the company IPO'd in 2023 with $1 billion Canadian valuation, but our float, so that's the amount that it's actually trading on the stock market, was only $150 million. That's because there was some private equity behind it. And what I've learned from that experience is that liquidity matters. 

You can have the best management team, the best assets, the greatest story ever. But in today's market, and we'll get into it a little bit, you need to be a certain size and a certain amount of float on the stock market to get attention. Personally, I think the markets have really evolved, especially in Canada over the last 20 to 30 years. Actually, I use the word evolved, but it's actually in a negative way. So I would say that they've changed in a negative way. 

And it's really limiting the ability for investors to help small companies grow. I don't know how we can fix this problem. I've got some different ideas, but I think it is a problem I see emerging getting worse year after year, particularly in Canada. Also, I think, and you know, when you talk about your cat story and like just the wider lens, the other issue to think about that's a detriment to capital formation in Canada has been the overburden of regulation. There are auditors involved and consultants and different all the stuff that needs to happen. We had a low-cost business model at Lithium Royalty Corp., but I was astounded at the amount of, in my opinion, non-productive work. Like it's not, it's just something that needed to get done, needed to happen as CFO of a Canadian small cap company. 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (05:35) 

Okay, great. A lot of things to talk about here. If regulation is pushing companies away from public markets, where does that leave investors? Because part of what we do is try to find value before the broader market catches on. 

So if the next generation of great companies stays private longer, that changes where the opportunity actually sits. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (05:55) 

Dominique, before you even answer that, it almost feels like what we're referring to is like a democratization of capital. Almost like the other direction. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (05:57) 

Yeah. Yeah. 

Okay, so we have to really be thinking about that retail investor and what their expectations are when they put money with you and Stephanie, for example. They're expecting a certain amount of liquidity. And so that I think is an emerging issue. While private equity solves a lot of problems because you don't have all of the reporting, the public reporting, there is reporting that goes to the private equity owner. But the burden of all of the regulation and disclosure that needs to happen really is much less for a private company. But that's where you come in, Mitch and Steph. You need to be able to explain to customers if they are going into a private equity product, and I'm happy I'm invested with you for the Alpine product, which is the Brookfield and Generation Investment Management. That's private. And I know that my money is in there for a very long time. It should be seven years plus. I'm thinking it's ten years plus, and that's my assumption and I know that. But that's retail investors need to understand then when they're putting money into either private credit products or private equity products, that they may be limited in liquidity. And as I discussed earlier, liquidity really does matter and matters as a public company investor, but also on the investment side. If you want to get your money out or you may and invest it in some a better opportunity or pay off debts or whatever, those customers really need to understand it. I guess for me the bottom line, if I was a genie and could be put back in a bottle, I wish we had not put in so many regulations. And I think that's Part of what we're seeing in Canada and in the US right now, they’re really starting to pull back on some of their regulation and disclosure. And even with the US going so far as to moving to disclosure to instead of quarterly reporting, but only twice per year. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (08:23) 

You know, listening to this, it's really a tale of two countries in a totally different direction. And if I've learned anything, maybe. One thing's for sure is money goes to where it's treated best. That's it. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (08:32) 

Yeah. You know, you hear that the Minister of Finance and Minister of Natural Resources in Canada describes money flows as water. Like it's gravity. It will just go to where it's easiest to go to. So absolutely you're onto something. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]  (08:58) 

Yeah. Yeah, and we don't necessarily always make it easy. But let's move on. Let's talk energy. so I think our listeners might have a bit of a strong reaction to this. So we find that we're now exporting natural gas to Germany as a country, and on the surface it sounds great, but Dom, you have a bit of a different take. what's up with that? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (09:05) 

Okay. Mitch, you and I have been looking at this for years and we've been watching sustainability and the energy transition and it is happening in other parts of the world. It's happening less so in Canada and even less so in the US. But if you go to China you talk to anyone who's been to China recently they will have come back being astounded at how many EVs are on the road there. 

And if you look at a barrel of oil, and if you Google it, you will see that about half goes towards gasoline. The rest goes to NAFTA or plastics or like jet fuel, for example. but most of it goes to gasoline. So as we have demand coming down, and the Financial Times is has been calling China will peak this year or next year at the latest, demand will peak and then start to go down. 

That's not a great thing for an energy exporter like Canada. And so I do worry about I mean we're so insular and we think that the rest of the world needs our energy. but I'm just I'm concerned that we might have the thesis wrong.  

So, you know, in the news recently we talked about contracting with German companies to buy some of our natural gas. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (10:58) 

Industrial base, right. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (11:02) 

I will say natural gas is different. Like I think natural gas, there's a heating value to it, there's an electricity part to it. 

That demand I think is going to grow over time. But what I would say a lot of the gas that will be sold to Germany will be going towards the industrial base. So companies the and again, I just use Chat GPT to say which companies are most energy intensive in in Germany. And it came out with BASF, which is a chemical company, Thyssenkrupp, I think it's a steel company, Covestro, Wacker, Lind, all of these companies have like they're going to use our natural gas and make better products out of it. Like why don't instead of us selling our natural gas, why don't we go to those companies and ask them to come to Canada and set up shop here and use our natural gas here, which would be a lot more efficient energy wise, but also would create a lot of jobs, would create a whole industrial base in Canada. So that's the sort of thinking that I'm lining up on. 

And that's where I get a little distressed about us continually exporting like you know just being a commodity exporter. It's not super value adding. and I'm just not sure how much it's going to impact it. We could take a different view and it could impact our economy much more positively if we had a wider lens, like you talked about in your opening statements with your cat story. 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]  (12:38) 

That's exactly the type of risk that doesn't show up cleanly on a discounted cash flow model. You're taking multi-decade bet on the world wanting energy dependence at the exact moment every major economy is trying to engineer its way out of dependence. This is really the essence of everything we talk about on this podcast. The risks that do not show up in a quarterly earnings call are often the ones that matter most over a 10 or 20 year holding period. So Dominique, as we close, we want to end on something forward-looking, positive, and promising. So we thought about it and came up with one final question for you. Mitch? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (13:15) 

Okay, go for it. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (13:16) 

I'm never good at one question, so it's one question, part A, part B.  

First, Steph, you couldn’t have said it better than myself. The essence of everything we're trying to explore lies in the last fifteen minutes of what we just discussed. So it's really, really great. There's so much to unpack here over time. But I always thought it's kind of important to be excited about tomorrow, even if I have no clue why. Sometimes. So as a parent you know, what does our generation have to do to get that bright light in our kids' eyes and have them be excited about what tomorrow brings for them here in Canada? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (13:56) 

Yeah, we're not making it very easy for them. I do have two kids. They're 19 and 20. And like most nineteen and twenty year olds, they do not listen to their mother. So I'll send them this podcast and maybe they'll listen to me through this medium. but you know, when I talk to them about when I think about the future and I talk to kids in university about the future and their job prospects or what they want to do. In fact, I just came from a lunch where I was talking to a mom giving similar advice. It's really about going to growth industries. Like what are the industries that are growing today or that have the highest potential to grow in the future? So for me in Canada, it feels like electricity, it feels like batteries and chemistry, AI or artificial intelligence, things like nuclear energy. Those are all I think promising areas to go to go into. But what I would also say, because I think there's a lot of pressure on kids to go to university. And I don't think university is the be all and end all. And I think trades or college are just as important as university and arguably more important.  

I don't know if you've heard this term wrench turner, like the wrench turner jobs. Those are going to take on greater importance in the future. and I recently met a couple, they're like 20 years old. They decided to forego university and went straight into a trade program for specialty in welding, and they're currently working on the small modular reactors. The first ones in the G7, they're being built in Canada. I don't know how many people are aware of this, but those will be the first small modular reactors or SMRs in the G’s in the world. There's a rumor that maybe China has one, but nobody's seen it. so this is kind of area that I think I would be thinking about going into. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (16:10) 

Amazing, you know, and those SMRs refer to those are not white elephants. I'm wondering whoever came up with that term. Do you have any idea? 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (16:21) 

No, I know we had talked about the term white elephants and I guess in the context of pipelines because I don't know if they’re building another pipeline, I just don't want it to be a white elephant. Did you look it up? 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (16:39) 

Of course. But I much preferred to be more familiar with the song White Rabbit from Jefferson Airplane. I love that song. Anyway, all that to be said, listen, Dom, I knew this was going to be a fantastic conversation. I guess I can't be too surprised. You know, as Stephanie and I walk on our own sustainability road, we've learned so much every time we've spoken. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (16:46) 

of course. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (17:07) 

And you know, it's really been valuable. I really, really want to thank you for that. Thank you for sharing some of your beliefs with our clients, colleagues and friends on today's podcast. A million thanks. Steph, you want to close this up? 

 

[Stephanie Morais, CIM, Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy] (17:22) 

Yes, of course. Dominique, this has been great. Thank you to you and to everybody listening. If today's conversation gave you a new way to think about risk in your own portfolio, that is exactly what we're trying to do here. Lastly, and most importantly, thank you for your confidence and your trust. We recognize the importance of our role and are committed to helping navigate the path towards your goals in the years ahead. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]  (17:46) 

Dom, you have the last word. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (17:48) 

Well, I'll just say there's no one more passionate about sustainability than you. And I hope you're still working on I know Mitch has been working on trying to get the banks to come up with some sort of green mortgage and has had lots of great ideas. And so I keep working on it. 

 

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM, Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy] (17:53) 

Ha ha ha. 

We're not done with that one, Dom. It doesn't matter where you sit, what you're doing, where you land, to be continued. Steph knows all too much about it. I'm sometimes forbidden to discuss it. Thanks, guys. 

 

[Dominique Barker, CPA, Former CFO of Lithium Royalty Corp] (18:07) 

I'm sure you're not. 

 

​[Energetic outro music] 

[CIBC logo] 

[The CIBC logo and “CIBC Private Wealth” are trademarks of CIBC, used under license. “Wood Gundy” is a registered trademark of CIBC World Markets Inc.] 

[CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy logo] 

[Contact information Mitchell Halickman and Stephanie Morais] 

[CIBC Private Wealth consists of services provided by CIBC and certain of its subsidiaries, including CIBC Wood Gundy, a division of CIBC World Markets Inc. 

This information, including any opinion, is based on various sources believed to be reliable, but its accuracy cannot be guaranteed and is subject to change. 

Mitch Halickman is an Investment Advisor with CIBC Wood Gundy in Montreal. The views of Mitch Halickman do not necessarily reflect those of CIBC World Markets Inc. 

Stephanie Morais is an Associate Investment Advisor working with Mitch Halickman, Investment Advisor. 

If you are currently a CIBC Wood Gundy client, please contact your Investment Advisor.] 

Back to Video
 

Beyond the Balance Sheet | The Global Impact Podcast Episode 1

April 13, 2026

Explore how impact-adjusted investing goes beyond traditional financial metrics to capture the true value and invisible impact of your portfolio.

 

[Energetic music]

[Episode 1 of The Global Impact Podcast with Mitch Halickman and Stephanie Morais, titled "Beyond the Balance Sheet." It features the CIBC logo and the text "CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy." The background displays a city skyline, and a soundwave graphic is shown at the bottom.]

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Welcome to our first podcast. As we kick off 2026, we hope you're feeling energized and ready for what's ahead. We know the headlines don't always make it easy to stay optimistic, but when we look at the bigger picture, there's actually a lot to be excited about, especially when it comes to building a more inclusive and sustainable future.

There's no denying it. The world is changing fast, and sometimes that can feel overwhelming, but today we want to cut through the noise and highlight a few of those shifts that we really think will matter for your investments. Progress is rarely linear. There are false starts and setbacks along the way, but new tools are emerging that help us better understand what truly matters and how to measure it.

For decades, markets have focused almost exclusively on a company's profitability. But what if that's only part of the story? What if that view is too narrow to capture the full picture of a company's value? Today we're joined by Mitch Halickman to explore a different way of thinking about how we measure the wealth corporations produce one that goes beyond the traditional metrics.

Put simply how do we recognize and quantify the invisible impact of our investments.

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Thanks, Steph. First off I gotta take a moment to say that it's been a real privilege working with you on the Halickman team. You've played such an important role in everything we do and I appreciate it. The key takeaway is this impact is no longer just a feel good metric. It's increasingly recognized as a driver of performance by applying guidance standards from leading international organizations, we have found new and advanced measuring tools.

The true economic return of a corporation can be substantially higher or lower than what the traditional accounting suggests. I felt for a long time that financial capital, human capital, and natural capital do not exist in silos. When we can have a deeper understanding of their connectivity, we could also envision how that leads to a more inclusive society where prosperity is more broadly shared. A sustainable, strong and healthy capital market is inseparable from a sustainable, strong, and healthy society.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM,
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Let's talk about how we quantify this broader impact. We use a term called impact adjusted, ROE. Can you explain to our listeners what that means?

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

For sure. Impact adjusted ROE is a way of expressing the additional value created by a corporation in a language the markets understand, by applying a dollar value to it. These figures aren't included in traditional financial statements, but that doesn't mean they don't materially affect a company's ability to create wealth.

As an example, companies that contribute to carbon reduction or resource efficiency create hidden benefits that are increasingly recognized by investors and required by regulators.

We found that firms with strong governance practices tend to be better aligned with regulators, which helps lower their long-term risks and also lowers their cost of capital. These elements combined to create that impact premium, enhancing the value produced by the securities included in our portfolio.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Let's talk about climate impact. Our portfolio is carbon negative. What does that mean in practical terms?

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Steph, why don't you walk our listeners through that one.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Sure. It means that through our investments in renewable energy and other sustainable assets, the avoided or removed carbon emissions exceed the emissions produced by the rest of the companies held in the portfolio. In an economy where carbon is increasingly priced higher, being carbon negative provides a significant competitive advantage.

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Exactly well said.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

For investors, how should they interpret the additional stakeholder value created beyond traditional reported profits?

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Think of it as a shadow dividend. It's not money you withdraw today, but it is a leading indicator of future proofing business models. For every dollar of reported profits, there's additional value embedded total earnings. So this shadow dividend can act as a navigation tool for corporations to follow, and it allows for a more resilient execution of any initiative they'll want to pursue.

Companies aligned with this methodology. While they'll find that they can be better positioned to handle new regulations, be able to attract loyal customers, be better positioned to retain and produce more motivated employees, and ultimately thrive in the future where wealth is valued just a bit differently.

Our approach is to invest in the whole picture, not just focus on what traditional gap accounting captures. We think that this broader lens helps us identify opportunities that others might miss. We think it helps us understand the headwinds and tailwinds that lay ahead for companies to navigate.

Really important to know, our primary focus as a fiduciary is to provide a strong risk-adjusted return for our clients. This is not being used for some kind of ESG scorecard. We see that using these tools provides us with a stronger, more accurate assessment of a corporation's true worth, that is our duty, our responsibility, and our job.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Mitch, thanks for joining us.

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Thank you for helping guide our listeners through our thoughts on measuring impacts.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

That's a wrap on our first episode, and we hope you enjoyed it as much as we did. We're excited to share that we already have some incredible guests lined up for the year ahead. We really think you're going to enjoy what's coming. Lastly, and most importantly, thank you for your confidence and your trust.

We recognize the importance of our role and are committed to helping navigate the path towards your goals in the years ahead.

​[Energetic outro music]

[CIBC logo]

[The CIBC logo and “CIBC Private Wealth” are trademarks of CIBC, used under license. “Wood Gundy” is a registered trademark of CIBC World Markets Inc.]

[CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy logo]

[Contact information Mitchell Halickman and Stephanie Morais]

[CIBC Private Wealth consists of services provided by CIBC and certain of its subsidiaries, including CIBC Wood Gundy, a division of CIBC World Markets Inc.

This information, including any opinion, is based on various sources believed to be reliable, but its accuracy cannot be guaranteed and is subject to change.

Mitch Halickman is an Investment Advisor with CIBC Wood Gundy in Montreal. The views of Mitch Halickman do not necessarily reflect those of CIBC World Markets Inc.

Stephanie Morais is an Associate Investment Advisor working with Mitch Halickman, Investment Advisor.

If you are currently a CIBC Wood Gundy client, please contact your Investment Advisor.]

 

[Energetic music]

[Episode 1 of The Global Impact Podcast with Mitch Halickman and Stephanie Morais, titled "Beyond the Balance Sheet." It features the CIBC logo and the text "CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy." The background displays a city skyline, and a soundwave graphic is shown at the bottom.]

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Welcome to our first podcast. As we kick off 2026, we hope you're feeling energized and ready for what's ahead. We know the headlines don't always make it easy to stay optimistic, but when we look at the bigger picture, there's actually a lot to be excited about, especially when it comes to building a more inclusive and sustainable future.

There's no denying it. The world is changing fast, and sometimes that can feel overwhelming, but today we want to cut through the noise and highlight a few of those shifts that we really think will matter for your investments. Progress is rarely linear. There are false starts and setbacks along the way, but new tools are emerging that help us better understand what truly matters and how to measure it.

For decades, markets have focused almost exclusively on a company's profitability. But what if that's only part of the story? What if that view is too narrow to capture the full picture of a company's value? Today we're joined by Mitch Halickman to explore a different way of thinking about how we measure the wealth corporations produce one that goes beyond the traditional metrics.

Put simply how do we recognize and quantify the invisible impact of our investments.

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Thanks, Steph. First off I gotta take a moment to say that it's been a real privilege working with you on the Halickman team. You've played such an important role in everything we do and I appreciate it. The key takeaway is this impact is no longer just a feel good metric. It's increasingly recognized as a driver of performance by applying guidance standards from leading international organizations, we have found new and advanced measuring tools.

The true economic return of a corporation can be substantially higher or lower than what the traditional accounting suggests. I felt for a long time that financial capital, human capital, and natural capital do not exist in silos. When we can have a deeper understanding of their connectivity, we could also envision how that leads to a more inclusive society where prosperity is more broadly shared. A sustainable, strong and healthy capital market is inseparable from a sustainable, strong, and healthy society.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM,
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Let's talk about how we quantify this broader impact. We use a term called impact adjusted, ROE. Can you explain to our listeners what that means?

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

For sure. Impact adjusted ROE is a way of expressing the additional value created by a corporation in a language the markets understand, by applying a dollar value to it. These figures aren't included in traditional financial statements, but that doesn't mean they don't materially affect a company's ability to create wealth.

As an example, companies that contribute to carbon reduction or resource efficiency create hidden benefits that are increasingly recognized by investors and required by regulators.

We found that firms with strong governance practices tend to be better aligned with regulators, which helps lower their long-term risks and also lowers their cost of capital. These elements combined to create that impact premium, enhancing the value produced by the securities included in our portfolio.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Let's talk about climate impact. Our portfolio is carbon negative. What does that mean in practical terms?

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Steph, why don't you walk our listeners through that one.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Sure. It means that through our investments in renewable energy and other sustainable assets, the avoided or removed carbon emissions exceed the emissions produced by the rest of the companies held in the portfolio. In an economy where carbon is increasingly priced higher, being carbon negative provides a significant competitive advantage.

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Exactly well said.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

For investors, how should they interpret the additional stakeholder value created beyond traditional reported profits?

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Think of it as a shadow dividend. It's not money you withdraw today, but it is a leading indicator of future proofing business models. For every dollar of reported profits, there's additional value embedded total earnings. So this shadow dividend can act as a navigation tool for corporations to follow, and it allows for a more resilient execution of any initiative they'll want to pursue.

Companies aligned with this methodology. While they'll find that they can be better positioned to handle new regulations, be able to attract loyal customers, be better positioned to retain and produce more motivated employees, and ultimately thrive in the future where wealth is valued just a bit differently.

Our approach is to invest in the whole picture, not just focus on what traditional gap accounting captures. We think that this broader lens helps us identify opportunities that others might miss. We think it helps us understand the headwinds and tailwinds that lay ahead for companies to navigate.

Really important to know, our primary focus as a fiduciary is to provide a strong risk-adjusted return for our clients. This is not being used for some kind of ESG scorecard. We see that using these tools provides us with a stronger, more accurate assessment of a corporation's true worth, that is our duty, our responsibility, and our job.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Mitch, thanks for joining us.

[Mitchell Halickman, CIM
Sr. Investment Advisor, Portfolio Manager, CIBC Wood Gundy]

Thank you for helping guide our listeners through our thoughts on measuring impacts.

[Stephanie Morais, CIM
Associate Investment Advisor, CIBC Wood Gundy]

That's a wrap on our first episode, and we hope you enjoyed it as much as we did. We're excited to share that we already have some incredible guests lined up for the year ahead. We really think you're going to enjoy what's coming. Lastly, and most importantly, thank you for your confidence and your trust.

We recognize the importance of our role and are committed to helping navigate the path towards your goals in the years ahead.

​[Energetic outro music]

[CIBC logo]

[The CIBC logo and “CIBC Private Wealth” are trademarks of CIBC, used under license. “Wood Gundy” is a registered trademark of CIBC World Markets Inc.]

[CIBC Private Wealth Wood Gundy logo]

[Contact information Mitchell Halickman and Stephanie Morais]

[CIBC Private Wealth consists of services provided by CIBC and certain of its subsidiaries, including CIBC Wood Gundy, a division of CIBC World Markets Inc.

This information, including any opinion, is based on various sources believed to be reliable, but its accuracy cannot be guaranteed and is subject to change.

Mitch Halickman is an Investment Advisor with CIBC Wood Gundy in Montreal. The views of Mitch Halickman do not necessarily reflect those of CIBC World Markets Inc.

Stephanie Morais is an Associate Investment Advisor working with Mitch Halickman, Investment Advisor.

If you are currently a CIBC Wood Gundy client, please contact your Investment Advisor.]

 

Back to Video
 
 
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